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Offline jostber  
#121 Posted : 07 February 2013 21:38:04(UTC)
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Vaessen Galaxy Ultimate Loudspeakers

http://www.ultrahighendr...xy-ultimate-loudspeaker/

Offline hifi addict  
#122 Posted : 07 February 2013 22:24:15(UTC)
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I have had 2 pairs of the Vaessen Box loudspeakers. I liked them a lot.
Offline ashleym  
#123 Posted : 07 February 2013 22:29:22(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: jostber Go to Quoted Post
Vaessen Galaxy Ultimate Loudspeakers

http://www.ultrahighendr...xy-ultimate-loudspeaker/



As I asked before, why these speakers? For example are we getting anything over and above an Vivid? Are we finally seeing nontraditional cabinets winning?

Edit, just seen the comment above, that will do for a why

Edited by user 07 February 2013 22:30:17(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

Offline Jimrod  
#124 Posted : 09 February 2013 12:37:47(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: jostber Go to Quoted Post
Vaessen Galaxy Ultimate Loudspeakers

http://www.ultrahighendr...xy-ultimate-loudspeaker/



I wish guys like this would just take a look at the styling of their product, it costs nothing! Take a step back, get some friends to take a look, but really when they're using all these "space-age" materials just sticking an oddly proportioned bronzed egg on top of a couple of slightly undersized grey boxes won't do anything to help sales. At this money you're out of reach for many Hi-Fi enthusiasts and into style-statement territory. Your city bankers out to impress their "chums" will want some flashy or elegant styling when they hand over a wad of cash to their interior decorators, not some thrown together assortment of shapes and materials.

I do feel that high-end Hi-Fi seems to have been left behind with regards to visual design. Look around any John Lewis at the assortment of well-designed dock type products and you wonder why those charging tens of thousands for their wares don't put more effort into industrial design rather than just leaving it to engineers, you can blend the two aspects easily with a little effort. I tend to think throwing some Kevlar, titanium or other exotic material into a product is all many companies feel they need to do to "style" something.

Offline ashleym  
#125 Posted : 09 February 2013 14:09:40(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: Jimrod Go to Quoted Post

I do feel that high-end Hi-Fi seems to have been left behind with regards to visual design. Look around any John Lewis at the assortment of well-designed dock type products and you wonder why those charging tens of thousands for their wares don't put more effort into industrial design rather than just leaving it to engineers, you can blend the two aspects easily with a little effort. I tend to think throwing some Kevlar, titanium or other exotic material into a product is all many companies feel they need to do to "style" something.



Absolutely agree. Look at the mega-Avalon and then the Kef Blade and tell me where the clever design is.

You can buy a product for any reason, colour, sound, price, brand but to get in to a lot of places you need the product to look good. Then again it is one persons taste to another. Look at the bling product that is apparently popular in the emerging marketsCrying

Offline Martin Colloms  
#126 Posted : 10 February 2013 09:56:31(UTC)
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I have been here :

audiophile stuff is low volume , even for a 'large' manufacturer

Industrial designers are very necessary , look at the work of Stark, Grange and Ives , noting that they are costly, and usually know next to nothing about audio.

Low production volume hi fi has often suffered at the hands of designers who impose terrible constraints on the acoustics in the name of aesthetics. The speakers barely sell.

If asked they will say that a good speaker is an invisible speaker, or , if it must be visible, it mus be a weird shape, small and very slim.

If you try to explain about driven area creating bass power they think of the wattage of various light bulbs and then offer a design based on a stylish lamp.

I recall a very prestigious design £20,000 in today's money which needed a 12inch bass. but the curvaceous shape which was delivered, despite instruction, would only allow a 7 inch. That was its primary death blow.

Radiated acoustics are quite prescriptive and they is only so much you can do. Vivid are I think the most successful at this and have some original solutions to address the challenges posed.

But the costs are raised and you have to like the rather striking results.


Martin Colloms
Offline ashleym  
#127 Posted : 10 February 2013 10:48:59(UTC)
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I feel for you as I havent been there.......

But isnt this bad design? The designer should know that the speaker needs a 12' driver and work to that. They shouldnt have a default "speakers must be slim" design. Look at what Pentagram did for Musical Fidelity from the Pre-amp to the A1. One looks bench made and the other a real product. Or the Pentagram (Kenneth Grange) designs for B&W- but I bow to others views on the success acoustically. I listened to and enjoyed the DM6 Penguins. I did meet the audio guy at Pentagram but he was from a telephony background, I dont know if they hired specialists or relied on B&W for specialist acoustic/audio input.

As for the more radical shapes, I have a problem here. I am happy with them but I hear too often that the sound is the only thing that matters and then anything radical is rejected. The old Kef Dalek 105s came with cover to make them square.......Vandersteens are just as guilty.......The same people who would say they wanted black hifi because it went with everything else. I would ask are your walls black or furniture or carpets? No. They had bought black hifi before and they werent going to change...Cursing Cursing Cursing

I know there are problems with making something challenging when the volumes are low and the market tends to conservatism. However few people challenge the "Most Advanced Yet Acceptable" (Raymond Lowey) principle. I accept this is what will happen but I dont have to like it!!!!

I am sure the new Avalon is the stste of the art for them, an evolution of the design (dont forget Darwinism is function follows form).

Hey thats not bad for a Sunday morning BigGrin BigGrin
Offline Jimrod  
#128 Posted : 10 February 2013 13:37:04(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: ashleym Go to Quoted Post

But isnt this bad design? The designer should know that the speaker needs a 12' driver and work to that.


This is correct, the visual designers and engineers should always work in tandem and there will always be compromises. If one area overrides the other to a degree which impedes performance or appearance to an unacceptable degree then it isn't being managed correctly.

It's pretty easy to come up with elegant solutions for both aspects of design - in the first instance the engineer should set the minimum parameters and the designers should work to that brief. It doesn't even need to be expensive design either, almost anyone with a basic eye for design can find and use an art/cad program nowadays - hell even the old fashioned sketch on the back of a napkin would do!

Just to be clear, I'm not having a dig at the particular company above but more of a general observation that high-end hi-fi seems to be one of the few consumer industries left which values function almost completely over form in many cases.

Edited by user 10 February 2013 13:47:47(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

Offline ashleym  
#129 Posted : 10 February 2013 13:57:50(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: Jimrod Go to Quoted Post

It's pretty easy to come up with elegant solutions for both aspects of design - in the first instance the engineer should set the minimum parameters and the designers should work to that brief. It doesn't even need to be expensive design either, almost anyone with a basic eye for design can find and use an art/cad program nowadays.



I understand what you are saying but a basic eye for design wont be good enough. People get what they can get made, get inspired from what has gone before (Japanese integrated amps, valve power amps) or have a retro inspired look for all its connotations such as Leben amps etc etc etc. And if it were so easy why dont we have more good looking kit? I am aware that there are industrial designers who do a lot of work in audio and this helps. Having inspiration from outside the industry helps. Knowing about new manufacturing processes and materials helps too.

I see that the D'Agostino power amps have copper heat sinks because it is a better heat conductor than aluminium therefore they can be smaller- or easier to deal with from a design perspective. But they cost and standard aluminium extrusions dont. But they do have power meters that dont have any real markings making them no more useful than the one I had on a Marantz amp over 30 years ago. And why the screw heads around the meter? There arent any others visible, if the design is watch inspired why isnt it knurled and screw on? It jars to me but others might like the juxtaposition and others see it all of a design whole.

Offline Martin Colloms  
#130 Posted : 11 February 2013 10:50:07(UTC)
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The meters are useful for quick checks on channel balance and power but little else

but every visitor admires them

and evenings when the lights are down they do look rather cool

expensive audio jewellery , but at least they sound good.

Martin Colloms
Offline jostber  
#131 Posted : 11 February 2013 19:57:02(UTC)
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ADL by Furutech releases the H118 Headphones

http://dagogo.com/adlby-...ases-the-h118-headphones

Offline malteser  
#132 Posted : 12 February 2013 16:00:57(UTC)
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Just looked at the Vaessen - the egg part is absolutely beautiful in my book, but then it seems to have been plonked onto a sideboard for the bass section! What a hideous combination to look at - at least the Vivids are complete organic forms.
Regards,
Frank.

All opinions are my own and do not reflect the opinion of any organisations I work for, except where this is stated explicitly.
Offline kengale  
#133 Posted : 13 February 2013 12:32:45(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: malteser Go to Quoted Post
Just looked at the Vaessen - the egg part is absolutely beautiful in my book, but then it seems to have been plonked onto a sideboard for the bass section! What a hideous combination to look at - at least the Vivids are complete organic forms.


How about the Vaessen Prado? Back to the 1950's!

Offline jostber  
#134 Posted : 13 February 2013 15:58:25(UTC)
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Offline jostber  
#135 Posted : 13 February 2013 15:59:12(UTC)
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Offline jostber  
#136 Posted : 13 February 2013 16:01:42(UTC)
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Synergistic Research PowerCell 10 SE MKIII

http://www.stereotimes.com/acc020813.shtml

Offline jostber  
#137 Posted : 13 February 2013 16:03:30(UTC)
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Capriccio Continuo Admonitor and Submonitor Loudspeakers

http://www.ultrahighendr...itor-loudspeaker-system/
Offline ashleym  
#138 Posted : 13 February 2013 18:02:23(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: jostber Go to Quoted Post
Capriccio Continuo Admonitor and Submonitor Loudspeakers

http://www.ultrahighendr...itor-loudspeaker-system/


While this list is interesting it just seems like a long list of random products and a lot of the links go to existing reviews. I asked before for a "why" as well as a "what" for reviews only to add a little more substance to the suggestions. I tend to suggest items I have heard, from manufacturers I like or products I am in the market to buy. Also the new top of the line Avalons, not that I will be buying them this week, are from a company with a good reputation staking their claim for the SOTA. Having transmission line and isobarik loading makes them interesting too.

So how about a look at the Totem Mani-2 Signatures. I like Totem speakers, always very musical. I like isobar(c)k loaded speakers. I like Mani as a bass player.

Offline Simon Briggs  
#139 Posted : 13 February 2013 20:24:58(UTC)
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Meridian Explorer USB DAC

Offers 24/192 audio by the looks of it.

http://www.meridian-audi...roducts/explorer-1000/4/
Offline Martin Colloms  
#140 Posted : 15 February 2013 08:29:31(UTC)
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we are making enquiries but Meridian are not significantly review conscious, certainly with respect to HIFICRITIC.

MartinC
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